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True2Ourselves Forums   > Community Topics > Theology  > Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

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Old 07-11-2012, 03:08 AM
AHJE's Avatar
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Question Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

We often call Jesus, the 2nd Person, the Son of God. Are we free also to call the 1st Person of the Most Holy and Undivided Trinity the Father of God? Is this theologically admissible?

In the Nicene Creed, We Profess:

"We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
one in Being with the Father. ..."


Many often think that Jesus is not God because we say more commonly that He is the Son of God, and yet He is God Himself. So why not call the Father ... the Father of God?


May the Most Holy and Undivided Trinity bless you all!


A. H. J. E.
After the Heart of Jesus Evangelist
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"... There is nothing more beautiful than to be surprised by the Gospel, by the encounter with Christ. There is nothing more beautiful than to know Him and to speak to others of our friendship with Him." (Pope Benedict XVI) [Homily of His Holiness, Sunday, April 24th 2005]

GOD MADE MARY
NE - CES - SARY.


When Jesus, the Living Bread, says IS He means IS.

Last edited by AHJE : 07-11-2012 at 03:32 AM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:58 AM
Moses
 
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AHJE View Post
We often call Jesus, the 2nd Person, the Son of God. Are we free also to call the 1st Person of the Most Holy and Undivided Trinity the Father of God? Is this theologically admissible?

In the Nicene Creed, We Profess:

"We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
one in Being with the Father. ..."


Many often think that Jesus is not God because we say more commonly that He is the Son of God, and yet He is God Himself. So why not call the Father ... the Father of God?


May the Most Holy and Undivided Trinity bless you all!


A. H. J. E.
After the Heart of Jesus Evangelist
This are very interesting questions that you raise.

In the book of Hebrews that we will be studying here in another tread.
It is written to Him all gods will bow.
It appears that the term god can have many levels of meaning.

In he book to Hebrews there is a question raised, to whom God sad you are My son today I have begotten you? Or I will be His father and He will be My Son. Did Jesus Man born of a Woman meet the Conciseness of Son of God?( my question.
And in another place it states that by Him he made the Worlds.

And since Jesus made us His brothers and sisters is it why we say
Our Father in Heaven.

And since we are not God (Gods) If we call the Father a Father of God don't we who are made Brothers of Christ call our self's God?

Some food for thought.

We are the Children of God yet we are not Gods.
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Old 07-11-2012, 07:11 AM
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

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Originally Posted by Moses View Post
This are very interesting questions that you raise.

In the book of Hebrews that we will be studying here in another tread.
It is written to Him all gods will bow.
It appears that the term god can have many levels of meaning.

In he book to Hebrews there is a question raised, to whom God sad you are My son today I have begotten you? Or I will be His father and He will be My Son. Did Jesus Man born of a Woman meet the Conciseness of Son of God?( my question.
And in another place it states that by Him he made the Worlds.

And since Jesus made us His brothers and sisters is it why we say
Our Father in Heaven.

And since we are not God (Gods) If we call the Father a Father of God don't we who are made Brothers of Christ call our self's God?

Some food for thought.

We are the Children of God yet we are not Gods.
Food for thought? Sheesh, not really. The triune God is not really difficult for man to understand if he does not already have an agenda of some sort.

You have a spirit, a soul and a flesh body. That would be three people, no wait, there is just one of you so you have three fully 'you' parts to your existence.
This is much more readily seen by people who have watched death come to a body. It is easier to see that the life is no longer in the flesh suit which was a vehicle for spirit and soul. Likewise, medical technology can keep a human body alive for a bit even AFTER the spirit has flown-Lifeshare does this when someone is declared brain dead and is a donor.
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Old 07-11-2012, 08:05 AM
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Whether or not it is acceptable theologically, from a practical point of view I don't think I'd use that terminology, AHJE. There are enough misunderstandings about the Trinity (and about the term "Mother of God" for Mary) as it is, without adding to the confusion.

The scriptures tend to use the phrase "God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ", so I'd rather just stick with that.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:03 AM
Moses
 
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maizie View Post
Food for thought? Sheesh, not really. The triune God is not really difficult for man to understand if he does not already have an agenda of some sort.

You have a spirit, a soul and a flesh body. That would be three people, no wait, there is just one of you so you have three fully 'you' parts to your existence.
This is much more readily seen by people who have watched death come to a body. It is easier to see that the life is no longer in the flesh suit which was a vehicle for spirit and soul. Likewise, medical technology can keep a human body alive for a bit even AFTER the spirit has flown-Lifeshare does this when someone is declared brain dead and is a donor.
Didn't Jesus assented in a Body, glorified but still a body.
Didn't Thoma touched the wounds of His hands and Didn't Jesus eat with the Disciples after the Resurrection.
So He was Flesh, Soul and Spirit.

The Spirit of Jesus is Holy Spirit and it was in King David when God told Him seat to my right. Or you are my Son I Today I have begotten you.
The Psalms written by King David are not only prophetic they are a state of a Son of God who was in Anointed(Messiah) King of Israel.

Godhead is God and I do argue still that there are only 2 personas in the Thriune God. That's another discussion.
I also think that Mother of God as RCC adds is also adds to confusion and may seem as Quadrature - God.

What is Begotten?

Last edited by Moses : 07-11-2012 at 09:06 AM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:25 AM
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Question Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Thanks for your responses everyone, ...

I posted this in the hopes that it would provoke some thought as to the Total Divinity of Jesus Christ and the unique Relation that the Father has to Him as such.

The 1st Person begets the Son who is God and who possesses the fullness of that reality.
So, eventhough it is not common to speak of the 1st Person as "the Father of God", ... still isn't it theologically TRUE and Valid?

Doesn't calling the 1st Person "the Father of God" help us to get a certain light on HOW the Father sees His Son?

The Father so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, God from God, that whosoever believes in Him might not perish but might have eternal life.


Praised be the Father who eternally begets the Son, the Son Who is God Himself.
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"... There is nothing more beautiful than to be surprised by the Gospel, by the encounter with Christ. There is nothing more beautiful than to know Him and to speak to others of our friendship with Him." (Pope Benedict XVI) [Homily of His Holiness, Sunday, April 24th 2005]

GOD MADE MARY
NE - CES - SARY.


When Jesus, the Living Bread, says IS He means IS.

Last edited by AHJE : 07-11-2012 at 09:28 AM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:50 AM
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

To address some of Moses' questions...

(1) Jesus is NOT a Human Person, ... He is a Divine Person ... He is God Himself.

(2) Jesus possesses a real and true Human NATURE which is united to His Divine Nature in the 1 Person as Son.

(3) The Sonship of Jesus Christ is Eternal and Uncreated. He is the Only Begotten, that is, ... He is OF the same Substance of the Father by very Nature.

(4) We who are Baptized into Christ are sons by grace, the grace of ADOPTION. No one is Son as Jesus is Son.

God bless you.
__________________
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"... There is nothing more beautiful than to be surprised by the Gospel, by the encounter with Christ. There is nothing more beautiful than to know Him and to speak to others of our friendship with Him." (Pope Benedict XVI) [Homily of His Holiness, Sunday, April 24th 2005]

GOD MADE MARY
NE - CES - SARY.


When Jesus, the Living Bread, says IS He means IS.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:53 AM
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Mary is the Mother of the whole Person of Jesus, not just His human nature.

And since, Jesus is not a Human Person, it is perfect and right that the All-Holy Mary be called the Mother of God Himself.

God bless you.
__________________
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"... There is nothing more beautiful than to be surprised by the Gospel, by the encounter with Christ. There is nothing more beautiful than to know Him and to speak to others of our friendship with Him." (Pope Benedict XVI) [Homily of His Holiness, Sunday, April 24th 2005]

GOD MADE MARY
NE - CES - SARY.


When Jesus, the Living Bread, says IS He means IS.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:12 AM
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

Lest anyone get the wrong idea, ... the point of this thread is, I guess, ... that too many people think that ONLY the Father is God. This is a grave error.

The Father is NOT the only Person that is God.
The Son is God Himself.
And the Holy Spirit is God Himself.

And YET there are NOT three Gods, but ONE. (... just when you thought that you had the Trinity all figured out ... well, ... just a reminder ... noone does and noone ever will ... this is why we call it a Divine Mystery, a Truth which is above, not against, human reason)
__________________
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"... There is nothing more beautiful than to be surprised by the Gospel, by the encounter with Christ. There is nothing more beautiful than to know Him and to speak to others of our friendship with Him." (Pope Benedict XVI) [Homily of His Holiness, Sunday, April 24th 2005]

GOD MADE MARY
NE - CES - SARY.


When Jesus, the Living Bread, says IS He means IS.
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:38 PM
Moses
 
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Default Re: Are we free to call the 1st Person the Father of God?

But we don't encounter in the scripture that father is the father of Son.
We always find that Father is God.
YHWH HaElohim.

Son the same substance, I remember reading how early Fathers of the Church debated that.

And As to Holy Ghost , yes its YHWH and its Christ's Spirit.

It was on King David when Samuel ANOINTED David to be King in Srael.
Anointed King is some one who has the HG of Christ the Son.
Evil Kings obviously didn't have it.

This is Why HG from the Father tells David seat to my right and I will ....
OR You are my son today I have begotten you.

This one is of special interest because its mentioned in the Book to Hebrews.
What is Today I have begotten you?

Some early Christians argued that Jesus the Man born of Mary and HG, was connected to the Son during the baptism and this way Adopted.

I'm not taking sides, but at least one early witness from 3ed century has the above verse during Jesus baptism instead the voice saying this is my son in whom I well pleased.

It's in that point that HG of Son, the anointing took place. Some argue.
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