True2Ourselves
Already a member? login
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
Divider
  
+
Register FAQ A-Z directory Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

True2Ourselves Forums   > Community Topics > Theology  > 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-26-2011, 09:13 PM
Peter
 
Posts: n/a
Default 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

The Tribulation 2015 - 2022

People need to see the Tribulation is very near! I am about to fearfully share something with you. If I don't explain this just right you will lose the feeling for it.

A Total Lunar Tetrad is when there are 4 Total Lunar Eclipses in a row over 2 years. Sometimes several centuries can go by in which there are none. They are even more rare when they fall on Passover, Tabernacles and again, on Passover and Tabernacles. In 1949/50 and 1967/68 was when just such lunar eclipses occurred. Israel became a nation May 14, 1948 and the armistice treatise was signed 1949. Israel entered Jerusalem on June 7, 1967. The next Total Lunar Tetrad on feast days is 2014/15 (8th since Christ). There won't be another till 2582/83. If the Tetrad is associated with the return of Christ because it is associated with the return of Israel, would it take over 600 years from 1948 for Jesus to return? I don't think so. Out of the 5 feast Tetrads since Christ before the 20th century, there was only one century which had two Tetrads so that is about a 5% (1/19) chance the 20th century could have two Tetrads. The probability one of the Tetrads would fall on either 1949/50 or 1967/68 is a 2% (2/100) chance and the other Tetrad on the remaining date is a 1% (1/99) chance. So the probability the Tetrad could fall on these two necessary dates in the 20th century was 5% x 2% x 1% = 1 in 100,000 chance.

"From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates" (Matt. 24.32-33). The fig tree always represents Israel which began putting forth its leaves in 1948 even earlier. When this occurs Jesus' return is very near! God is placing these Lunar Tetrads right on top of Israel's most important events to tell us He is thinking of them and letting the Church know His return is right at the door. By 2015 it will be 67 years since 1948. Some consider verse 34 to be the return of Jesus within a generation after Israel becomes a nation: "Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place." My view is 'this generation' refers to the ongoing morally wicked generation these past two thousand years but consummated in this final generation. Would Jesus return 100 years or more after Israel becomes a nation? It would not seem to make sense given what Matt. 24 says and Rev. 6: "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood" (v.12). I'll explain.

Three things happen in order (Rev. 6.12): 1) earthquake (Haiti 2010 was the 5th worst disaster in history; or another disaster could could occur 2011-2013, possibly in United States, because none of the top ten disasters have touched North America), 2) a very unique solar eclipse, and 3) a very unique lunar eclipse. It is difficult to get people to understand that Revelation 6 is the past 20 centuries and is general in nature, but try to suspend your judgment for the moment and treat the 1/4 that are killed (v.8) as being a different time than the 1/3 that are killed (9.18) so that the sixth Seal which contains these three events will occur shortly before the Tribulation starts. The sixth Seal precedes the First Rapture to "the throne" (Rev. 7.9) that is according to readiness (Matt. 24.40-42, Luke 21.36, Rev. 3.10) and is before the 7th Seal (8.1) which opens up the ****ing of the 7 Trumpets of the Tribulation - Daniel's last "unit of seven" (Dan. 9.27). The first Trumpet is ****n first (8.7ff) and the first 4 Trumpets are completed in the first 1260 days of the 2,520 days of the Tribulation. The Tribulation is loud like trumpets. Much is going on. The past 20 centuries are the mystery age of the Church (7 church periods in Rev 2 & 3) where the Seals are opened secretly. Have you not had the feeling you are a sojourner in the world, and those who are not saved seem to not understand us at all no matter how much we explain God's redemptive design to them? They are more interested in the world so they carry on in the world.

The first Seal recounts the cross as though Jesus were newly slain in Rev. 5: "As though it had been slain" (v.6) is, in the original, rendered "as though it had been newlyslain"—This clearly proves that this is the scene of the ascension of the Lord. Although the death of the Lord is forever fresh, the word here designates it as being newly slain. In the first Seal the work of the cross is revealed as shown by the image of a bow but the arrow has been shot giving Satan a deadly wound by the cross when Jesus died not only your sins, but the sins of the whole world for forgiveness of sins. A bow strikes from afar as the Conqueror goes forth to conquer from this point of authority (v.5). He is the same Rider in chapter 19. He also brings us to sure death (co-death) with Him on the cross to our old man for power over sin and self. If our old man has died what does Satan have to work with through our flesh? Thus, we are able to put to nought the deeds of the flesh because we accept God's pronouncement we have died with Jesus on that eternal cross, are resurrected in our spirits now (touching the heavenly), and will be resurrected bodily and soulically in a resurrection like His. Nothing can separate us from the love of the One True God.

We have accounted for the earthquake and the lunar eclipse but what about the solar eclipse in between? There are 4 kinds of solar eclipses. The rarest is the Hybrid eclipse which occurs about 5% of the time. There are 3 kinds of Hybrids, the rarest which is the H3 at about 4% of the time. And there are two kinds of eclipses - short and long-dated. On Nov. 3, 2013 we will witness a long-dated H3 Solar Eclipse (4th since Christ). The probability of this type of eclipse occurring in the 21st century right next to and in front of the 2014/15 Tetrad is approximately 1 in 700 (3/20 centuries x 1/100 years in a century). Combine this with the Total Lunar Tetrad, the odds decrease substantially for these two events to be connected and come together in the precise order required by verse 12 of chapter 6. 1/700 x 1/100,000 = 1 in 70,000,000. Could we ask for a better sign for the beginning of the Tribulation to occur? I can't think of one.

Daniel's seventy sets of seven (Dan. 9.24-27) are 7 years x 360 days per year = 2,520 days each. 2,520 is the smallest divisible number by all numbers from 2 to 10, so it is a basic working unit in Daniel's vision. I believe the last 3 feasts pertain to the return of Jesus while the first 4 feasts were about His first coming. The Feast of Trumpets is associated to the First Rapture according to readiness (Luke 21.36, Rev. 3.10). There are 2,520 days from Sept. 14, 2015 (Feast of Trumpets) to Tisha B'Av, Aug. 7, 2022. Tisha B'Av is the day the Jews commemorate the destruction of the 1st and 2nd Temples. This is significant because Jesus returns to reign in the 3rd Temple. What's even more interesting is that normally Tisha B'Av takes place on Av 9, but when Av 9 falls on a Sabbath the Jews commemorate it the day after. It so happens than in the year 2022, Av 9 occurs on a Sabbath (Aug. 6) so Tisha B'Av is held on Sunday instead (Av 10) which amazingly is the 2,520 day from Sept. 14, 2015 (Feast of Trumpets). Aug. 6, 2022 was the 2519th day. It is also nice to see Jesus returns on a Sunday since that is the day He resurrected.

As an interesting aside, there are 17,640 days from June 7, 1967 when Israel took over Jerusalem to Sept. 23, 2015, the Day of Atonement. The Day of Atonement is when Israel ushers in the Jubilee year. 17,640 / 360 days per year = 49 years. The 50th year is a Jubilee year. For those who want to study further, they will soon discover 3986 BC to 2015 AD is exactly 6000 years or 120 Jubilees. 3986 is the 18th year of Adam from 4004 BC - for him it was his age of accountability. And Ezekiel's prophecy on one side for 390 days and the other side for 40 days takes us exactly to May, 1948 to the month for when Israel would become a nation again.

The 30 days from the 1260th to the 1290th day are for Jesus to judge the nations. From the 1290th to the 1335th day is 45 days more to set up Israel as the center of all nations from where Christ will reign in the 3rd Temple. Israel will not reign as kings and priests, for this reward is given to overcomer believers in Christ. Only a fraction of believers "overcometh" to return (Jude 14,15; Rev. 20.4) to reign during the 1000 years. Non-overcomer believers lose this reward in "outer darkness," outside the light of reward of reigning with Christ for the 1000 years. From the 1260th day (Aug. 7, 2022) to the 1335 day takes us to Oct. 21, 2022 after the 3 feasts are completed. Feast of Tabernacles begins on Oct. 10, 2022. It goes for 7 days to Oct. 16, 2022. There are two holidays that follow - Oct. 17 and 18. The second holiday is called Simchat Torah when the Jews take out the three items in the Ark (Old Testament practice) or the Torah Scrolls to read them. If we treat the 4 days as an inspection of the Lamb for Jesus to begin His reign in the millennium then Oct. 18-21 are the 4 days which conclude on the 1335th day, Oct. 21, 2022. October 22, 2022 begins the millennial reign with a "rod of iron." Talk about coincidences: I was born in 1967 on Oct. 21, and my mother was born in 1948. Then again so was Prince Charles, so what. I am aware of the difference between coincidences and impossible odds. 1 in 70,000,000 is too much for me to accept as mere coincidence in addition to all these other findings and dates that fit so well.

To assure us further, from 2014 to 2021 and 2016 to 2023, the 2,520th day from Feast of Trumpets do not fall on Tisha B'Av because an extra 30 days was not added. Every 2 or 3 years an extra thirty days are added to the Jewish calendar. Since the Tetrad in 1949/50 and 1967/68 occurred on the key events pertaining to Israel's reclamation, then the Tribulation-Daniel's final seven years-should begin on the Tetrad in 2015 since 2014 as we have seen doesn't fit. 2017 is too far out and 2013 is too soon because the Temple can't be completed by then. The meaning of the 2300 days (Dan. 8.14) refers to the last 2300 days in the Tribulation after the Temple is completed so that the Temple would need to be completed by the 220th from the starting date of the Tribulation. The Third Temple needs to begin construction by 2013 so there is three and a half years to build it (I suppose it could start in 2014 if they can get it done in two and a half years).

The 220th day is April 20, 2016. The 4 days inspection of the lamb and red heifer for the New Temple are April 18 (Monday, Nisan 10), 19, 20, 21. The 2300 days then start April 21, 2016. Passover is April 22, 2016. When do the Two Witnesses, Enoch and Elijah, begin preaching for 1260 days? Interestingly, there are 1260 days from April 18, 2016 (first day of inspection) to Sept. 30, 2019 (Feast of Trumpets). After the first 42 thirty day months, the Great Tribulation begins on Feb. 25, 2019 (Rev. 9.1). In Revelation 9, the 5th trumpet (1st woe) takes 5 months. The 6th trumpet (2nd woe) begins on July 25, 2019 which lasts for 13 months (time, times, and half a time). The 7th trumpet (3rd woe) begins on Aug. 18, 2020 and lasts for 24 months to Aug. 7, 2022 (Tisha B'Av) when Jesus steps down.

I'm either wrong or right about this timing. I have never said with 100% certainty I can't be wrong, but it is all quite spectacular how it all fits so well like a glove. I am unable to disprove this proof, just as I am unable to find a naturalistic explanation for the origin of the disciples' beliefs. This gives me confidence. Praise the Lord! Amen.

Leading up to these moments and dates, many will be kicking against the goads, fighting these very words delivered unto the saints.

www3.telus.net/trbrooks/return_of_Jesus.htm
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-27-2011, 02:05 PM
Giuliano
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

I guess we can stop worrying about the Social Security problem here in the US. I just heard that the CBO projects that Social Security will be broke by 2037.

CBO Projects Social Security Will Be Drained By 2037: Do You Think The Next Generation Will See a Solvent Social Security System? - ABC News

And people worried about the increase of the world Muslim population can stop worrying.

2030 world Muslim population put at 2.2B - UPI.com
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-27-2011, 02:35 PM
thelowlyfisherman's Avatar
Knight of the Forum
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,497
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

I thought the cosmic alignment was going to destroy the earth 12-23-12?
Think I'll just do my best to tend to the needs of His sheep and I'll worry about the end when it gets here.

Matthew 6:34
"So do not worry about tomorrow; for tomorrow will care for itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.
__________________
Matthew 23:12:
Whoever exalts himself shall be humbled; and whoever humbles himself shall be exalted.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-27-2011, 05:29 PM
Peter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

The most important thing is to ovecometh before Sept. 14, 2015 for if you overcome in Christ, you will be raptured at that time to escape the hour of trial that is come upon the whole world (Rev. 3.10).
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-27-2011, 10:38 PM
Giuliano
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
The most important thing is to ovecometh before Sept. 14, 2015 for if you overcome in Christ, you will be raptured at that time to escape the hour of trial that is come upon the whole world (Rev. 3.10).
That's your take on it.

You use the Jewish calendar for months and days but don't use it for years. The Jewish calendar says it's the year 5771. You're following the computation that the world began in 4004 B.C.

You should remember too that the current Jewish calendar is a substitute for the real thing. To get the authentic dates, you would need to grow barley in Palestine since the year begins only if that barley is there. If it's not there, the new year is postponed a month. Thus, the computed festivals could be a month off.


Why would we want to flee the wrath to come? To leave the earth filled only with sinners, with no one on earth to pray for them?

Then you refer to Revelation 3 as being in the future. Revelation 1 says that the things which follow would be happening "soon." You have it as coming nearly 2000 years later. Why read the rest of the book if we don't take the first verse seriously?

Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Did they come to pass shortly? If not, the book isn't true. There's no point in trying to use it to predict the future. Now if you could struggle with it and figure how it was true then, how those things did come to pass then, you'd be in a position to understand what implications the book has for us today.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-28-2011, 01:43 PM
alphaomega
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
The most important thing is to ovecometh before Sept. 14, 2015 for if you overcome in Christ, you will be raptured at that time to escape the hour of trial that is come upon the whole world (Rev. 3.10).

what if ;

you have this trib occurring between 2015 and 2022
-------------"right?"

what if this is something else other than the great trib?

what i believe you have marked here in the rein of anti-Christ
with the exception of 2022 running into 2023

pushing my thoughts further;
i would say that the rapture will not take place in the first 3 & 1/2 years
* Daniel"s 1290 days ( as anti-Christ defiles the temple) with the rapture following 45 days later as the days reach 1335.

this would put the rapture at 2018

and would be shortly followed by the 3&1/2 years of Enoch and Elijah
with their death occurring then in 2022

2023 then would have Apollonian BEING RELEASED with the scorpions with hair of women and putting anti-Christ into the pit

on your post --- good stuff
hope we can talk more
pm; me if you wish
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-28-2011, 02:20 PM
alphaomega
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giuliano View Post
That's your take on it.

true; but should we be quiet and not think ?

You use the Jewish calendar for months and days but don't use it for years. The Jewish calendar says it's the year 5771.
and from the book of Enoch we know the Jewish calendar to be wrong

You're following the computation that the world began in 4004 B.C.

You should remember too that the current Jewish calendar is a substitute for the real thing. To get the authentic dates, you would need to grow barley in Palestine since the year begins only if that barley is there. If it's not there, the new year is postponed a month. Thus, the computed festivals could be a month off.

thats what happens when they used a 360 day calendar instead of the 365 day calendar of Enoch


Why would we want to flee the wrath to come?
our want to leave should not be confused with why we are to leave . it is in our time that we our gone that the wedding supper takes place. it also allows the time frame for the work of Enoch and Elijah as well as the time frame for the 144,000 to come into existence and the martyrs to have their time as well.

To leave the earth filled only with sinners, with no one on earth to pray for them?
truly you realize that after Adam and Eve were at the tree ; the world contained only sinners and god still brought about his will. YOUR PRAYERS ARE NOT THEIR WAY TO SALVATION

Then you refer to Revelation 3 as being in the future. Revelation 1 says that the things which follow would be happening "soon." You have it as coming nearly 2000 years later.

Why read the rest of the book if we don't take the first verse seriously?
JESUS IS A DOOR;
thats your take on it
would you also say Jesus is made of wood and has a knob placed in him so that we may open the door

a day with the lord is like unto 1000 years
whats so hard in seeing 2000 years is just a couple of days to the lord ?

Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Did they come to pass shortly?

cant you wait the two days

If not, the book isn't true.

so you say ; but then then you are just using your understanding and not letting the whole bible tell the whole story aren't you ?
There's no point in trying to use it to predict the future.
Now if you could struggle with it and figure how it was true then,
how those things did come to pass then,
you'd be in a position to understand what implications the book has for us now; two days later today.
BUT THIS WOULD TAKE US AWAY FROM THE TOPIC POSTED HERE
we would need to look at the Lazarus story;
the prodigal son story;
the part of David always having a king over Israel story ( etc)

and for time sequencing --- the mount of transfiguration

in other words ; we need to see all that the bible has to say
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-28-2011, 03:41 PM
Peter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by Giuliano View Post
y refer to Revelation 3 as being in the future. Revelation 1 says that the things which follow would be happening "soon." You have it as coming nearly 2000 years later.
Revelation are the churches of the day when John was alive but they are also representing the church periods yet in the future from John's perspective. No it is not 2000 years later. I would say Sardis began around the 1500's. Philadelphia 1828. And not long after that Laodicean of differing opions to this day.

"Write therefore the things which thou sawest, and the things which are, and the things which shall come to pass hereafter"—The meaning of "therefore" is to continue on with what has been said already. Because of the victory of the Lord, "therefore" these things ought to be written.

Moreover, this verse lays clearly before us the division of this book: (1) the things seen (the past), (2) the things which are (the present), and (3) the things which shall come to pass hereafter (the future).

The word "sawest" in the original is in perfect form, which indicates that something has already been seen. This refers to the vision which John saw as recorded in chapter 1.

The things which are mean the things which are now existing, and hence these are the things that exist during the church age as reported in chapters 2 and 3.

The things which shall come to pass hereafter are those things that will continue to happen after the church age. All the chapters after chapter 4 up to chapter 19 are the descriptions of these things which are to come.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-28-2011, 03:46 PM
Peter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaomega View Post
what i believe you have marked here in the rein of anti-Christ with the exception of 2022 running into 2023
Since the Tribulation has to start on the Tetrad and 2014 doesn't work then the Tribulation of 2,520 days starts Sept. 14, 2015 Feast of Trumpets and Jesus returns Aug. 2022 Tisha B'Av. The 7 years is the reign of the Antichrist. How can the Antichrist reign into 2023 if Jesus returns Aug. 7, 2022?

From the 1260th day when Jesus steps down on the mount of olives to the 1290th day is 30 days Jesus judges the nations. 45 days more to the 1335th day Jesus sets up Israel as the center of all nations. That takes us to after the 3 feasts to the 4 day inspection of Jesus and taking out the Torah Scrolls on Oct. 18, 2022. Oct. 18, 19, 20, 21. Oct. 21 is the 1335th day from Aug. 7, 2022. Oct. 22, 2022 the millennial kingdom begins.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-28-2011, 04:25 PM
Giuliano
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: 2520 Days of the Tribulation from Feast of Trumpets 2015 to Tisha B'Av 2022

Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaomega View Post
true; but should we be quiet and not think ?
People can think all they want, for what it's worth. Everyone has his opinion. What are they worth? People have been predicting this kind of thing for centuries -- all in vain. So let's keep doing it? Surely, as Solomon said, "There is nothing new under the sun."

Quote:
You use the Jewish calendar for months and days but don't use it for years. The Jewish calendar says it's the year 5771.
and from the book of Enoch we know the Jewish calendar to be wrong
So you say. I wouldn't know. That doesn't make Bishop Ussher's date of 4004 BC right. That's even less probable than the Jewish date.

We also know that the monthly Jewish calendar is not right. So why use the altered Jewish months but abandon their years?
Quote:
thats what happens when they used a 360 day calendar instead of the 365 day calendar of Enoch
Perhaps the year once did have 360 days.
Quote:
Quote:
Why would we want to flee the wrath to come?
our want to leave should not be confused with why we are to leave . it is in our time that we our gone that the wedding supper takes place. it also allows the time frame for the work of Enoch and Elijah as well as the time frame for the 144,000 to come into existence and the martyrs to have their time as well.
I really don't know what you're talking about.

Quote:
Quote:
To leave the earth filled only with sinners, with no one on earth to pray for them?
truly you realize that after Adam and Eve were at the tree ; the world contained only sinners and god still brought about his will. YOUR PRAYERS ARE NOT THEIR WAY TO SALVATION
First of all, while we might say Adam sinned, Genesis itself doesn't use the word "sin" until Cain murders Abel. Do not tell me that no one could pray then. They could talk to the LORD and did.

Not all was lost. Noah was descended from Adam, and he was said to be "perfect in his generations." God gave dominion over the earth to man. It remains man's. That is the reason Jesus had to come as a man, to exercise lawful authority over the earth. God is not a dictator; and He doesn't take back gifts He's given.

God's plan has always involved mankind voluntarily choosing right. If there were not even one person on earth to pray, the earth would not be worth saving. It would collapse since God would judge it as not worth saving. His plan would have failed if that were ever the case.

The problem with many rapture believers is they believe also that God's plan will fail. Mankind will become so wicked, God will give up on it -- then they imagine God will swoop them up to Heaven saving them and wreaking vengeance on all the sinners. It is not so. God always has a "remnant" on earth. Always. Noah was not swooped up to Heaven. Lot was not. Abraham was not. They were needed on earth. The tares were removed. The wheat was left. But rapture theory has the wheat taken first with the tares left behind. What kind of thinking is that? How could more wheat be sown and grown if all the wheat was taken away?







Quote:
Then you refer to Revelation 3 as being in the future. Revelation 1 says that the things which follow would be happening "soon." You have it as coming nearly 2000 years later.

Why read the rest of the book if we don't take the first verse seriously?
Quote:
JESUS IS A DOOR;
thats your take on it
would you also say Jesus is made of wood and has a knob placed in him so that we may open the door
The text does not say the door opens only after 2000 years in a rapture. It's in the PRESENT TENSE.

John 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

Does that describe the rapture in your view? Jesus said he had found all the sheep given to him; and he prayed:

John 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

Quote:
a day with the lord is like unto 1000 years
whats so hard in seeing 2000 years is just a couple of days to the lord ?
Jesus is talking to John, a man. Moreover there are numerous references in the New Testament that says the "end of the age" would come in that generation. Some people were promised they would see the return of Jesus. Jesus said it, and similar things were said many times by the Apostles. It means "soon" in human terms. Jesus promised John he would see his return --and he did!

How people turn and turn. I collected many of these passages in a thread, The End of the Age. With so many passages, why do people insist on this rapture thing? Why do they think the end of the age didn't occur then just as predicted?

Quote:
Quote:
Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

Did they come to pass shortly?
cant you wait the two days
I tell you John saw the coming of Jesus just as promised. It was "soon" and with no tricks or hard language to grasp:

John 21:22 Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come , what is that to thee? follow thou me.
23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die : yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?


Why interpret "soon" to mean two thousand years? That would be soon in God's eyes; but it wouldn't be soon for John. Which is it? Well, did John die without seeing the return of Jesus?

Did Caiaphas see the return? Did those who nailed him to the cross see it? The Bible says they would. I guess that means later, much much later? It could ... if other passages didn't clear it up.

People have this idea of how they think Jesus must return; and they imagine physical clouds and the like. Then having this picture in their minds, they refuse to believe he did return because it doesn't fit the picture they have of it. They then have to try to interpret other passages to fit their theories.
Quote:
I
Quote:
f not, the book isn't true.
so you say ; but then then you are just using your understanding and not letting the whole bible tell the whole story aren't you ?
Please go read the long list of Scriptures in the other thread before concluding I'm ignoring parts of the Bible. Read them with an open mind and see if I'm making sense or not.

Quote:
Quote:
There's no point in trying to use it to predict the future.
Now if you could struggle with it and figure how it was true then,
how those things did come to pass then,
you'd be in a position to understand what implications the book has for us
now; two days later
That's right. If you can discern how the signs of the times played out then, you are in a far better position today to read how the "times" today will play out. If people don't understand how Jesus did return to people then, they won't see how he can return to them today. By dismissing the clear passages which promise the return in that generation, they confuse themselves and turn the passages into complete confusion. I laugh when people think of PHYSICAL clouds when they read about Jesus' returning in clouds. As if Jesus would need material clouds of water vapor! I wonder if the same people who think this also think that Israel was baptized by a physical cloud of water vapor. Paul says so. In 1 Corinthians 10:1-2.
Quote:
BUT THIS WOULD TAKE US AWAY FROM THE TOPIC POSTED HERE
we would need to look at the Lazarus story;
the prodigal son story;
the part of David always having a king over Israel story ( etc)

and for time sequencing --- the mount of transfiguration

in other words ; we need to see all that the bible has to say
For the moment, checking the references in the list in the other thread may be enough to determine this one point of when the end of the age occurred and whether Jesus' return was to be "soon" in human terms. If you want to discuss other things, we can do so in the other thread since it's not active. But I think it reasonable to look at the passages in the OP first. It isn't all that hard if you can clear up the simple things first. People are apt to try to figure out the future by collecting all kinds of prophecies and projecting them into the future -- when often those prophecies were fulfilled. Things get all tangled up. They start off with a premise and dig through the Bible looking for something to prop up their idea. I find some of it shocking, to tell the truth.

For example, people dig and pull out this or that from Joel. This, they say, is what the future holds. They do what you imply I've done -- ignore some things. Peter said people were seeing that prophecy fulfilled in front of their eyes. But that doesn't stop people from saying it's going to happen soon. They seem oblivious to what Peter said. Jesus said all the things he spoke of in Matthew would happen in that generation -- and then people ignore that and project events into the future as if Jesus didn't say that. If asked, they give some feeble answer about "this generation shall not pass." It really isn't hard if you accept it as written. That generation did not pass. There were people standing there who saw those things.

So now what is the latest prediction? Someone using the make-shift substitute Jewish monthly calendar devised by Maimonides (when the Jews could not follow the original since they had no way to do it) and then using Christian years as computed by Bishop Ussher. Pick and choose. Jewish months, Ussher's years. You throw another monkey-wrench into the works, trusting something derived from the Book of Enoch.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What Tribulation position of the rapture do you hold to? WaterWalker Theology 54 09-24-2010 04:30 PM
A Preview Of Tribulation Persecution Of Christians. DrFrank General Discussions 72 06-21-2010 08:54 AM
The vials , the trumpets and the woe's colin Theology 0 05-08-2010 07:35 PM
Why isn't this the tribulation? christkid777 Bible Chat 12 04-15-2009 06:41 PM
The letters, seals, bowls and trumpets. Heneni Theology 20 02-12-2009 05:34 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:48 AM.


true2ourselves
 
 
 

Flashcoms

You need to upgrade your Flash Player.

Version 8 or higher is required.

download from http://www.adobe.com/go/getflashplayer

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29