[Olsen]

I would be interested in what our community thinks regarding the cause of homosexuality.I have often thought that without knowing the answer to this question the Christian community is not well equipped to fully deal with it particularly on a pastoral level. It may be over simplistic to simply lump homosexuality into the pool of sexual disorders although I am personally convinced that that is precisely where it belongs. I am for the moment more interested, however, in the opinions of others.

I am also interested in the opinions of our community regarding the importance of determining that cause whether it be to "cure" this condition; accommodate it; or simply condemn it regardless of its cause.

[ICT7133]

Originally Posted by Olsen

I would be interested in what our community thinks regarding the cause of homosexuality.I have often thought that without knowing the answer to this question the Christian community is not well equipped to fully deal with it particularly on a pastoral level. It may be over simplistic to simply lump homosexuality into the pool of sexual disorders although I am personally convinced that that is precisely where it belongs. I am for the moment more interested, however, in the opinions of others.

I am also interested in the opinions of our community regarding the importance of determining that cause whether it be to "cure" this condition; accommodate it; or simply condemn it regardless of its cause.

I think homosexuality is a deviate condition. By that I mean that God did not design it into the human being, but sin and all the fall and corruption it brought along with it also corrupted the genes that control a person's sexuality.
That said, let me state that I have no personal, or religious bias, towards those who are homosexuals, but that is not to say I approve of their lifestyle.
I have a nephew who is homosexual, an aunt (I suspect two, really) who are lesbians, and have had friends who were homosexual.
Does that mean I throw the Bible at them everytime I see them ? That I do not attend their funeral when they die, and visit them at hospital when they get sick.
Decidedly not.
If they ask me what the Bible says about it, I will outright tell them the Bible says God hates it, because that is what the Bible says. I will also tell them I personally believe that homosexuality is a form of deviancy that is latent in all mankind, and God's restraining power holds it off, for the sake of those whom He loves. (Reference: Romans 1:26-28).
I believe there is no homosexual who will ever inherit the kingdom of God (1 Cor 6:9), but I also believe that God is able to save His people from this sin and change them (1 Cor 6:9-11). Based on the same Scripture I do not believe a truly redeemed child of God who professed to have experienced His saving grace can be both a practicing homosexual and a believer.

Many times, in forums and discussion boards, the question has been thrown about the issue of same-sex marriage and I have found that Canada's solution seems to be perfect.
Somebody in another discussion board, a pastor in Canada, says that there is a law in Canada that frees clergy from the responsibility of marrying same-sex couples if they feel their religion forbids it thus placing the responsibility squarely just on the shoulders of civil authority.
Do I approve of same sex marriage ?
Yes, why not. After all, even if I bombard same sex couples living together with Scripture day in and day out, they will still live together in their deviant fantasy world and one day they will split, either by divorce or death, so why shouldn't they have equal rights with heterosexuals ?
Do I believe they should have the right to be married in church ?
That depends on the church and the minister.
Personally, I will not marry them, even if it means jail, because I believe marriage was instituted by God only between a man and a woman. But Scripture was written to be strictly obeyed and adhered to by God's people, not mankind (Romans 15:4) so I will not slam these beliefs down their throat, just as government shouldn't slam its deviant laws down a believer's throat.
It has also been asked: should same-sex couples or homosexuals/lesbians be allowed to join (as in membership) a church ?
Again, it depends on the spiritual temperature of the church.
When I was pastoring, had a same sex couple or a homosexual come in to the service, they would be welcome and treated as fellow human beings, anytime.
However, if they say they would like to join the church, the answer is an uncompromising no. Church attendee is different from church member. The attendee does not have the obligation to live his life in accordance with Scripture, nor to give testimony of saving grace (because he might not even be able to), and the church is under no obligation to own him a member to the public.
The church member, on the other hand, is bound by the church covenant, has an obligation to the Lord to live a separated life unto the Lord, and the church is under obligation to own him/her as a member to the public.
Too long an answer.
Sorry.

[Rose]

ICT7133, I have a hard time understanding how you could approve of same sex marriage if you truly believe that homosexuality is a deviate condition. Wouldn't condoning same sex marriage be the same as saying you find nothing wrong with practicing homosexuality? i don't get it.

[ICT7133]

Originally Posted by Rose

ICT7133, I have a hard time understanding how you could approve of same sex marriage if you truly believe that homosexuality is a deviate condition. Wouldn't condoning same sex marriage be the same as saying you find nothing wrong with practicing homosexuality? i don't get it.

Oh you would get it, Rose, if you just understand that God's laws, principles, and regulations, all written in the Bible, are meant for His people, not for mankind, therefore I do not believe in obligating the world and its governments to live in according to God's standards because the world and its government will always be in opposition to God's standard.

However, a professing believer, one who says he has come to know and trust in Christ, is a different story. If he is who he says he is, then he knows he has a Lord and Master, and that is, Christ, who demands absolute obedience from him.
Also, a professing believer is supposedly, a convert: from sin, from false conceptions about God, from ungodly and unrighteous living, therefore he cannot be a professing believer, and a practicing homosexual.

That's like a hitman, an assassin, saying he is a Christian, and makes his living killing people.

I have not come across, in the Bible, where the married couple must sign a piece of paper, called a marriage contract. I think, and I may be wrong, that custom and later on laws, brought this about, including the right to equal protection by the government for married couples. And that is what the homosexual community is fighting for. That partners be granted legal access to the protection afforded under the law for others: conjugal property, insurance, etc.

I have nothing against that, however, if I am a minister, then my obligation to my God comes first, and my God says, the practice of homosexuality is abomination to them, and in marrying them, I will have to invoke God's blessings on them, and I cannot do that, no, I will not do that.

[RevStevenMRobinson]

There are many sins listed in the bible but there is special mention to those who are lovers of the same sex....it holds such a strong place in God's order that it can lead those who practice it to a reprobate mind......one who doesnt even concern himself (or herself) with the sin and the price that comes with living in the sin.
This leads me to the cause of homosexuality.......the need to go against God.....it is a sin.....plan and simple.....

[BranKnewCreatureN559]

After careful thought and consideration to the other messages posted, I decided to post one myself. I've thought about the homosexual issue a lot lately because I have several friends who have called themselves "gay". Knowing what the Word of God says about the homosexual, it has lead me to much prayer because I love my friends with every fiber of my being just as The Father loves them. One of the things I've discovered over the years since receiving the gift of Salvation in 1996 was almost a sense of outright judgement against homosexuals throughout much of the church. As I continue my walk, I've encountered many among the bretheren who struggle with alcohol, drugs, fornication, and adultery. I've encountered liars, cheaters, thieves and homosexuals, but praise God, they have been redeemed...set free! Washed by the blood of the Lamb!! Although they walk in the righteousness of Christ and are cleansed, do they walk in perfection? Often not. Do they sometimes stumble and commit the very sin that led the to the Cross of Forgiveness in the first place?? Absolutely. The Word of God speaks to those who will not inherit the Kingdom of God - those who have not received Jesus as their Lord and Savior. Those who have not been made righteous and pleasing in His sight. I believe, with no doubt in my mind, that those who have the issue of homosexuality and have truly called on the name of Jesus and accept Him as their Lord and Savior will inherit the Kingdom of God as the others have. Does it mean it is ok to practice a homosexual lifestyle. No. The Word of God tells us to turn from sin. And, those who truly love Christ will work hard to do it (because through Him, we can overcome all things). Often times, I strongly believe, it is very easy to point fingers at a homosexual as though their sin is the worst of the worst because it simply takes the focus of of us and our own sin - did you know gluttony was a sin? being overweight is a sin? stealing some of the office supplies at work makes you a theif? chatting on the phone with your best friend on company time is stealing? We need to remove the plank from our own eyes first...Praise God for the Blood of Christ which covers a multitude of sin...Praise Jesus, Lover of Our Souls, Lover of Sinners, for dying for us all. Pray for those you know that practice homosexuality that they come to know Christ. Remember, He came not to comdemn the world, nor should we. We should love them, introduce them to Christ, and allow Him to make the changes that need to be made. A person challenged in any area of sexual sin, who has truly called Jesus as their Lord and Savior, is just as much a child of the Most High God as any of us!

"Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the Spirit of our God." (I CORINTHIANS 6:9-11).

[Mark]

BranKnewCreatureN559 -

Great post! Not sure I'd compare the severity of the homosexual lifestyle to "chatting on the phone to a friend at the office" ... but your point is well taken.

[AFI]

Originally Posted by Olsen

I would be interested in what our community thinks regarding the cause of homosexuality.I have often thought that without knowing the answer to this question the Christian community is not well equipped to fully deal with it particularly on a pastoral level. It may be over simplistic to simply lump homosexuality into the pool of sexual disorders although I am personally convinced that that is precisely where it belongs. I am for the moment more interested, however, in the opinions of others.

I am also interested in the opinions of our community regarding the importance of determining that cause whether it be to "cure" this condition; accommodate it; or simply condemn it regardless of its cause.

I do think that the cause of homosexuality is an important issue to research and talk about. The church cannot properly look at the issue of homosexuality without a complete understanding of the issue and that included the causes. I also believe that looking at the causes can be important because not understanding the issue can causes misconceptions.

I believe that there are three main factors in any sexual orientation, one Genetics, two ones environment, and upbringing, and thirdly personal choice. This is the same for homosexuality. There is strong evidence that there is a gay GEAN that is present in a large segment of the population. This is a non-dominant GEAN so it only appears in about half of the people who have the GEAN. The upbringing and personal choices heavily influence whether or not the gay GEAN is activated and also affect the degree to which they are affected, for example are they closer to bisexual or complete homosexuality. This is further supported by studies by child psychologists in which they did a study on several children at age 5. They were able to predict with amazing accuracy what the sexual orientation of those children would be once they hit puberty.

The importance of acknowledging the genetic and environmental causes of homosexuality is in how we expect them to change. We need to realize that it is more complicated than simply choosing or not choosing to be Gay and that while they may be able to change their actions they may never be able to change their orientation.

[JesusIsReal]

Originally Posted by Olsen

I would be interested in what our community thinks regarding the cause of homosexuality.I have often thought that without knowing the answer to this question the Christian community is not well equipped to fully deal with it particularly on a pastoral level. It may be over simplistic to simply lump homosexuality into the pool of sexual disorders although I am personally convinced that that is precisely where it belongs. I am for the moment more interested, however, in the opinions of others.

I am also interested in the opinions of our community regarding the importance of determining that cause whether it be to "cure" this condition; accommodate it; or simply condemn it regardless of its cause.

Globalism is about taking polls and survey's, but it's not of God's Word. I was in that death-style (bi-sexual) and I repented and believed all over again without regret some over 16 years ago. And that was after I was born-again of 2 years. I fell away - hard, but came to my own self conceits and repented coming back to my Heavenly Father. And I would forgive any repentant bi or **** sexual, but those who are not repentance have no forgiveness but the wrath of God abides on them, as I had when I became rebellious unto God and His Holy Word. I soon believed it was what I ought to be able to 'do', but I soon after that learned that it was about what God 'hath said' - My Heavenly Father says it's an abomination, it is sin. It still is. You can not dialogue God's Truth to say any thing else, but men of the flesh will try - it feels good - lovers of pleasure to dialogue away from God's Authoritive Word.

Olsen, what does God's Word tell you, above the community-group think, how you read it in God's Word? By saying God's Word is what sets others free when they repent and believe.

[AFI]

JesusIsReal

Yes we do have Gods word, however there are many issues that are not fully discussed in the bible, or that are open to question, and so there is nothing wrong with the Christian community discussing our beliefs on the issue, weather it is elaboration on the issue or talking about different interpretations of scripture.

In this case we are discussing some aspects of homosexuality that are not discussed in the bible, for example the Genetic and environmental factors in the forming of sexual orientation. And as I said in my previous post on this thread looking at the causes of sexual orientation is important because it has a direct relation to the degree of change that people can make.