[DanielSlack]

"You can judge a society by how they treat their weakest members." Mahatma Gandhi

Firstly, most Christians deny the existence of animal intelligence to feel or comprehend pain. In the Bible, there are examples of the animals being intelligent conscious entities. The original Torah, one of the Jewish Holy Books, refers to the snake as a snake. NOT AS SATAN, this was added later through "Christian Translators."

In Chapter 3 of Genesis:

1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"

2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

The first question that comes to mind is when Eve was being deceived by the serpent, wouldn't a talking snake be a bit suspicious? She could have told Adam or God "Hey I found a talking snake what do think, I thought animals couldn't talk". I know if a serpent started talking to me I think breaking the rules would be the last thought in my mind.

In this train of thought, it is logical to assume that most creatures that Adam and Eve were with could talk, because of Eve's lack of surprise. This also leads to the conclusion that animals have a high amount of intelligence, and the same capacity to sin as well. Immediately this makes me question rather the Tower of Babel incident was when man stopped communicating with animals, not from man talking to other men.

In The Book Of Numbers Chapter 22:

27 When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat her with his staff. 28 Then the LORD opened the donkey's mouth, and she said to Balaam, "What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?"

29 Balaam answered the donkey, "You have made a fool of me! If I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now."

30 The donkey said to Balaam, "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?" "No," he said.

31 Then the LORD opened Balaam's eyes, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell face down

In this example we have another conversation between an animal and a human. I have had it often explained that it was GOD, an angel, or some demon that spoke through the animal. The problem with that is unless GOD, Angels, or Demons have been carrying Balaam and his luggage all over the land, it is definitely the voice of the donkey.

Jesus' message is one of love and compassion, yet there is nothing loving or compassionate about factory farms and slaughterhouses, where billions of animals live miserable lives and die violent, bloody deaths. Jesus mandates kindness, mercy, compassion, and love for all God's creation. He would be appalled by the degree of suffering we inflict on animals to indulge our acquired taste for their flesh.

Christians have a choice. When we sit down to eat, we can add to the level of violence, misery, and death in the world, or we can respect His creation with a vegetarian diet.

The Garden of Eden, God's perfect world, was vegetarian (Gen. 1:29-30). Immediately, God calls this ideal and non-exploitative relationship "good" (Gen. 1:31). There follow many years of fallen humanity, when people held slaves, waged war, ate animals and committed various other violent acts. But the prophets tell us that the peaceable kingdom will be nonviolent and vegetarian; even the lion will lie down with the lamb (e.g., Isaiah 11). Jesus is the Prince of Peace, who ushers in this new age of nonviolence. When Christians pray, "Your will be done, on Earth as it is in heaven," the one prayer given to us by Jesus, this obligates us to change our lives, to make choices that are as merciful and loving as possible. There will be no factory farms and slaughterhouses in heaven.

God created every animal with the capacity for pain and suffering. But on today's factory farms, animals are dehorned, debeaked, and castrated without anesthesia. To maximize profits, they are crowded together in the least space possible, and are genetically bred, so that most suffer lameness, crippling leg deformities, or bone breaks, because their legs can't keep up with their scientifically enhanced bodies. Finally, they are trucked without food or water, through all weather extremes, to a frightening and hellish death.

A vegetarian diet is good for your health and spares animals unimaginable suffering and violence. Remember: As we do to the least, so we do to Him.

Is it mans right to determine the passage of life and not God's. Does our food deserve to live in the same condition that the Jews did in Aschweitz?

Unfortunately, we use religious dogma to justify "Wars" in the name of GOD, to justify violence "IN THE NAME OF GOD", and we even torture "IN The Name Of GOD". The main excuse for these acts is either "It Says We Can In the Bible", or "Jesus Died For My Sins".

God has given us an infinitely powerful ability for compassion and mercy. The walk of Jesus exhibited how we should bestow these concepts, amongst our fellow humans."Jesus forgave the Murderer, Jesus Forgave the Thief, Jesus forgave the liar, and Jesus made us free.", but we have a responsibility to treat all life as sacred. All life is a blessing from GOD.

I eat meat. BUT, I do not believe in the mistreatment and torturing of GOD's creatures before it gets to my table. These creatures who give their lives deserve a little comfort and happiness before ending up in my oven. I eat organic open range products, to try to ensure that my food is treated like a living creature and not like an item for the shelf.

"29 Are not two sparrows sold for a copper coin? And not one of them falls to the ground apart from your Father's will. 30 But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 Do not fear therefore; you are of more value than many sparrows." Matt. 10

Originally Posted by DanielSlack

"You can judge a society by how they treat their weakest members." Mahatma Gandhi

Firstly, most Christians deny the existence of animal intelligence to feel or comprehend pain. In the Bible, there are examples of the animals being intelligent conscious entities. The original Torah, one of the Jewish Holy Books, refers to the snake as a snake. NOT AS SATAN, this was added later through "Christian Translators."

In Chapter 3 of Genesis:

1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"

2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

The first question that comes to mind is when Eve was being deceived by the serpent, wouldn't a talking snake be a bit suspicious? She could have told Adam or God "Hey I found a talking snake what do think, I thought animals couldn't talk". I know if a serpent started talking to me I think breaking the rules would be the last thought in my mind.

In this train of thought, it is logical to assume that most creatures that Adam and Eve were with could talk, because of Eve's lack of surprise. This also leads to the conclusion that animals have a high amount of intelligence, and the same capacity to sin as well. Immediately this makes me question rather the Tower of Babel incident was when man stopped communicating with animals, not from man talking to other men.

In The Book Of Numbers Chapter 22:

27 When the donkey saw the angel of the LORD, she lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat her with his staff. 28 Then the LORD opened the donkey's mouth, and she said to Balaam, "What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?"

29 Balaam answered the donkey, "You have made a fool of me! If I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now."

30 The donkey said to Balaam, "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?" "No," he said.

31 Then the LORD opened Balaam's eyes, and he saw the angel of the LORD standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell face down

In this example we have another conversation between an animal and a human. I have had it often explained that it was GOD, an angel, or some demon that spoke through the animal. The problem with that is unless GOD, Angels, or Demons have been carrying Balaam and his luggage all over the land, it is definitely the voice of the donkey.

Jesus' message is one of love and compassion, yet there is nothing loving or compassionate about factory farms and slaughterhouses, where billions of animals live miserable lives and die violent, bloody deaths. Jesus mandates kindness, mercy, compassion, and love for all God's creation. He would be appalled by the degree of suffering we inflict on animals to indulge our acquired taste for their flesh.

Christians have a choice. When we sit down to eat, we can add to the level of violence, misery, and death in the world, or we can respect His creation with a vegetarian diet.

The Garden of Eden, God's perfect world, was vegetarian (Gen. 1:29-30). Immediately, God calls this ideal and non-exploitative relationship "good" (Gen. 1:31). There follow many years of fallen humanity, when people held slaves, waged war, ate animals and committed various other violent acts. But the prophets tell us that the peaceable kingdom will be nonviolent and vegetarian; even the lion will lie down with the lamb (e.g., Isaiah 11). Jesus is the Prince of Peace, who ushers in this new age of nonviolence. When Christians pray, "Your will be done, on Earth as it is in heaven," the one prayer given to us by Jesus, this obligates us to change our lives, to make choices that are as merciful and loving as possible. There will be no factory farms and slaughterhouses in heaven.

God created every animal with the capacity for pain and suffering. But on today's factory farms, animals are dehorned, debeaked, and castrated without anesthesia. To maximize profits, they are crowded together in the least space possible, and are genetically bred, so that most suffer lameness, crippling leg deformities, or bone breaks, because their legs can't keep up with their scientifically enhanced bodies. Finally, they are trucked without food or water, through all weather extremes, to a frightening and hellish death.

A vegetarian diet is good for your health and spares animals unimaginable suffering and violence. Remember: As we do to the least, so we do to Him.

Is it mans right to determine the passage of life and not God's. Does our food deserve to live in the same condition that the Jews did in Aschweitz?

Unfortunately, we use religious dogma to justify "Wars" in the name of GOD, to justify violence "IN THE NAME OF GOD", and we even torture "IN The Name Of GOD". The main excuse for these acts is either "It Says We Can In the Bible", or "Jesus Died For My Sins".

God has given us an infinitely powerful ability for compassion and mercy. The walk of Jesus exhibited how we should bestow these concepts, amongst our fellow humans."Jesus forgave the Murderer, Jesus Forgave the Thief, Jesus forgave the liar, and Jesus made us free.", but we have a responsibility to treat all life as sacred. All life is a blessing from GOD.

I eat meat. BUT, I do not believe in the mistreatment and torturing of GOD's creatures before it gets to my table. These creatures who give their lives deserve a little comfort and happiness before ending up in my oven. I eat organic open range products, to try to ensure that my food is treated like a living creature and not like an item for the shelf.

"29 Are not two sparrows sold for a copper coin? And not one of them falls to the ground apart from your Father's will. 30 But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 Do not fear therefore; you are of more value than many sparrows." Matt. 10

I suppose then I might need to more prayerfully consider whether I dip my corndogs in Mustard or ketchup from now on.....

Sorry I'm in a bit of an ornery mood today!

God Bless!

Michael

[Amadeus]

I understand where you are coming from DanielSlack, and may God richly bless your continued efforts to gain respect from people for all of God's creatures.

[RevStevenMRobinson]

God made coats of skins for Adam and Eve in the garden, and accepted many sacrifices made by man from animals.
God gave us the earth to use for our benifit, as well as the things of the earth including the animals.
I understand where you are coming from, and i obviously cant speak against your feelings, I can see your side.
I also know that we are giving these things of the earh by God.......for us to use.
But maybe we should consider your thoughts.........i will not, however, stop eating meat.
Which i know you stated is not a bad thing. but we should think

Acts 10:9-15:

9. On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour:

10. And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,

11. And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:

12. Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.

13. And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.

14. But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.

15. And the voice spake unto him again the second time:

....What God hath cleansed,
that call not thou common...

God Bless!

Michael

[fat]

Is Eating Meat GODLY

?


Christ is God and He ate meat. Next question.