[Israel]

Malachi 3: 1-18

1Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the LORD, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

We all should no and understand that the messenger that came preparing the way of our Lord Jesus was his cousin John the Baptist. Who sent this messenger God did. Who did he prepare the way for? Christ. Is not Christ of God, his first begotten? Yes he is. To be off something means that you consist by the attributes of the very thing you are of. That means Jesus is God. So the spirit sent this messenger to testify and prepare the way for the spirit to work. God is spirit therefore all that is begotten of him is spirit also.

2But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Only those that are willing to submit to the refining of fire, which is the purging of the flesh will be able to abide in his coming. The fullers’ soap is the blood of Christ that we are washed with as we submit to the will of God. We can’t be washed and not submit to God. If we do not submit we remain dirty and of a fleshly nature instead of being of God, and a Godly nature as our Lord and savior Jesus Christ.

3And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

Jesus Christ is the refiner. He came to reconcile man back to God by refining or renewing mans mind (conscious) back to God. Our conscious is the silver that needs to be refined. Christ did purify the sons of Levi, and he purge them of there their authority that they had presented themselves to be. This was done because the Sons of Levi throughout the years had consistently walk contrary to the commandments of God and even the Law of commandments (penalty for sin). The Levites themselves didn’t walk with a pure conscious, but sought after following the order of many other nations. They put aside the commandments of God, and followed after the world, just like what happens in today’s so-called churches. In the process the Levites (Priest) became self-righteous, and not patterned after Godly righteousness. They added and taken away from the commandments, laws, which are all the words of the living God. This is what they had to be purified from and purged from. They where purged and purified by being set down, and Christ baring the order and authority of the Priesthood within himself, because of there disobedience.

4Then shall the offering of Judah and Jerusalem be pleasant unto the LORD, as in the days of old, and as in former years.

Christ came out of Judah, which is the tribe of the Kings of Israel. Christ is know both King of Kings, and High priest after a different order then Levi. Because Christ came out of Judah and is now also High Priest, who also makes the offering to God out of presenting us as we submit to his will, this is how the offering of Judah and Jerusalem is pleasant unto the Lord. Levi is not longer High Priest; therefore he not longer can live of the tithes. Now that Christ is High Priest we offer up spiritual tithes, offerings, and sacrifices to our High Priest. What does the spirit need the carnal (fleshly) for? The spirit does not need any thing carnal to live of like money, or anything of a fleshly nature. We give our spirit to God, and offer our bodies as a sacrifice. We sacrifice our bodies by denying the flesh and the fleshly nature. We deny the flesh and the fleshly nature by not giving in to the lust of the flesh, the pleasure of the eyes, all things that are deemed to be in high regard by the flesh, the order of man, the government of man, the doctrine of man, the religion of man, and the false church which is made by mans hands. The true Church and undefiled is who we are within as we submit to Gods will. Those that submit to Gods will, is the Church. This is the Church made without hands. So for those that say well the church needs my tithe money to operate. What Church are they talking about? Surely they can’t be talking about the Church made within us through Christ. God doesn’t need any product of the fleshly nature to function. God’s creation also doesn’t need money to live. The earth was made self-sustaining. If the economy fell off the earth right now, the earth and all its inhabitants will have everything they need to still live. But we are often clouded by the fleshly mind so that we can’t see what we should.

5And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the LORD of hosts.

God through Christ Jesus has brought Judgment to the earth and will bring final judgment in all things later. Christ is against the sorcerers, which are those that partake in magic, and all manner or craft that is of a spiritual nature outside of the order of God. Christ is against the adulterers both in the flesh and in the spirit. One commits physical adultery when one sleeps with someone outside of a marriage. There is not difference in spiritual adultery. God is the husband, and the church is the wife. If the wife (Church) goes astray and follows other doctrines, it is then committing spiritual adultery against God. Christ is against a liar of the mouth, just as he is against one who advocates false doctrine. Christ is also against those that oppress (tax) the hireling (worker) of his wages (earnings) both in the physical and in the spiritual. One is oppressed in the physical of his earnings when he is forced to pay tribute (tax) and usury (interest) to the false authority of man. In the spiritual we are robbed and oppressed when we are forced (brought under privilege) or penalized (under due process of mans law) for not submitting to the order of man through mans government, which is a tribute (tax) and usury (interest) against the spirit. Christ is against those that oppress the widow, and the fatherless in the physical just as in the spiritual. We already know who the widows are and the fatherless are in the physical, therefore it needs no explanation. The widow and the fatherless spiritually is the one whom is lost, in his or her conscious, and is exploited by those that see their weakness. Christ is against those that turn aside the stranger from his right both in the physical and in the spiritual. We are turned aside from our God given rights when we are forced and brought under the privilege of mans government and order. We are brought under privilege in the physical and the spiritual at once, when we are given license by mans law to do the things that we have a God given right to do. Man has no authority over another man by God, but he assumes a possession of authority above all that is called by and for God. Man was not the start of any of Gods creation, so where is his authority given? The bible says surrender our self, and subject our selves to the higher power, which is God, and God only. Who is putting themselves over all things that God has made? Man puts himself over all that God has made and created through the power of Satan.

6For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

God has not changed, but remains the same in all things. God consistently brings forth life, and the ability to continue life in all things through the spirit. Man through the nature of man remains to be contrary to God. Because God shows mercy and is consistent in showing so, there is hope that all will not be consumed. Because man has consistently walked contrary to God, those that remain this way will be destroyed by there own nature from within.

7Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the LORD of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return?

God continues to call out to those that are lost, to bring them back to the Godly purpose of their creation, but man in his fleshly nature is to blind to see God. We must have pure hearts (pure conscious) to see God. As long as man remains in the fleshly nature of a man he will remain impure and not able to return back to the ordinances (purposes) of God. Man in his nature asks what is there to return to, and for what purpose? The purpose of returning to God is eternal life. Man being fleshly minded can only see the glory of the fleshly, therefore those that are guided by the fleshly will be void of the spiritual. If we put off the nature of the flesh by submitting to God, which is returning to him, he will then also return and live in us.

8Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

What has man robbed God in? Is it money? Is it anything of carnality (fleshly)? No. Man has robbed God, by not submitting his spirit, which he received of God, back to God in obedience. We are the tithe and the offering, but we continually as we walk in the flesh bring ourselves subject to the deeds of the flesh and not God. That is how we truly rob God. When the carnal Priesthood was in effect, there was a carnal tithe that was given to Levi the Priest to live off, because he had no inheritance with the rest of the tribes. When those that lived at the time of the carnal priesthood didn’t follow the order of paying tithes to this priesthood, they robbed the priesthood, buy not submitting to the commandments of God to pay tithes of physical substance. But we all, then and now rob God in tithe and offerings when we do not submit our spirit, and bring not our bodies under subjection to the spirit of God. That was the higher purpose of the schoolmaster, which is the carnal priesthood so all could understand the spiritual priesthood of Christ. Where is Levi today? Are we under the order of the priesthood given to Levi, or are we under Christ, who priesthood is not carnal but spiritual? Most will reply that they are under Christ so then why do we walk in the order of Levi baring Christ in it? We walk in the order of Levi when we pay a carnal (money) tithe, thinking it is required of a spiritual order also. Under Christ we are to present our bodies as a living sacrifice, which is the tithe, offering, and sacrifice which will lead all that submit to eternal life. Christ doesn’t need mans money, nor does he want it. Christ wants you to willingly submit to him. One way or the other we all will submit to God, either willingly or by force. He has given us the free will to choose. Choose eternal life by dying to the nature of the flesh, and you will live forever. Choose the fleshly life to live by now, and you continue to die now, and in the here after.

9Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.

The nation of Israel robbed God because they refused to submit to him, just as the world today continues to perpetuate this same deed. This is why the curse of death remains to be present and run ramped. When I say death I’m not only talking about the fall of the fleshly body, but I more so am talking about the fall of the conscious. Our conscious is fallen when we don’t bring it subject to God. When we don’t bring our conscious subject to God, our conscious is then subject to the nature of the flesh. When we do this we are dead before the fall of the body. When we do this judgment is already cast. When the servant of God calls out to these dry bones (fleshly nature), it is calling out to ones spirit to be submissive to the God. When we are submissive to God, his nature is our nature. When we do this we return back to the purpose that he created man for, which is in Gods image and likeness. Stop robbing God. Give back to God by giving your spirit in subjection to God. Remember we can’t submit to God totally, when we also submit ourselves subject to the flesh.

10Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

How many have give carnal tithes consistently, and consistently not been blessed? How many give to the so call churches, and not receive any thing in return? How many give to the so-called churches, but when it comes to your needs the doors are closed. How many see that the only one who is blessed in the so-called churches is its pastor or its leader by whatever title he calls him or herself? How is it we see more churches in the ghetto and more crime at the same time? Where is God? He is not in those places. One must first understand that the church of God is in you. Christ spoke about the church made without hands being what he has built. Why then do we continually seek a building as the church? Wake up my people. Wake up. Walk as the body of Christ, the church, the tabernacle, the holy city, the New Jerusalem, which are all the Lords habitation. Walk with the understanding that God lives in you. Understand that we can’t put the church of God (his spirit) on the shelf. We must continually walk holy before the Lord. The bible says in I John 4: 17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world. So why to we bring ourselves subject to man if we are as he (Christ) is? Something to think about isn’t it.

11And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts.

The devourer of our sake is the one that is against us, and our purpose as we are of the purpose of God. When our purpose (sake) is inline with God’s purpose (sake) he will safe guard us. God’s sake is his every word, which is commandment. When we live after the purpose of God, which is his every word, we have transformed by the renewing of our mind to walk after the spirit, and not the flesh.

12And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.

When are purpose is inline with Gods purpose, we are the delightsome land. The land that we are is the church, the tabernacle, the New Jerusalem, the Holy City, which is all the Lords habitation. How many understand that we are the land of the Lord as abide in him and he in us? In order to walk as spiritual being we must understand that are the land

13Your words have been stout against me, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, What have we spoken so much against thee?

The words of the fleshly man represented by Israel has always been contrary or against God, because the fleshly can only see with the physical eye. But those that submit to God see all things in spirit. Because the fleshly man can’t see spiritually his ways are against the ways of God.

14Ye have said, It is vain to serve God: and what profit is it that we have kept his ordinance, and that we have walked mournfully before the LORD of hosts?

We often hear lots of individuals say “ Its fine to serve God”, but in the real world we have to do this or do that. In the real world we have to pay taxes. In the real world we must fall subject to mans law. In the real world we need money to live. In the real world we need to vote in regarding the election of officials to run the nation, state, county, and cities. See how man regards the fleshly nature of man more than God. When we regard God above all things, we need not regard any order of man that is contrary to God sake, and purpose. We need to stop letting the fleshly nature tell us what we need. When we let the nature of the flesh do this, we are guided and in bondage to the flesh.

15And now we call the proud happy; yea, they that work wickedness are set up; yea, they that tempt God are even delivered.

As we walk after the flesh, wanting, and lusting after all the things of a fleshly nature, we see those that have obtain much in the flesh to be blessed and happy. These individuals are caught up in the bride of a fleshly life. Those that have much in this life often times obtain through wicked works. Those that are set up in government, banks, corporation, and false churches are the workers of iniquity. That is hard to swallow. Some would say in reading this, “How can you through all these people into the same pot? All I can do is answer with scripture. Exodus 23:1-3,7-9 1Thou shalt not raise a false report: put not thine hand with the wicked to be an unrighteous witness. 2Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil; neither shalt thou speak in a cause to decline after many to wrest judgment: 3Neither shalt thou countenance a poor man in his cause. 7Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked. 8And thou shalt take no gift: for the gift blindeth the wise, and perverteth the words of the righteous. 9Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger: for ye know the heart of a stranger, seeing ye were strangers in the land of Egypt. We must all understand that we put our hands with the wicked when we submit to the order of the wicked. When do we see the servants of God submit to the order of the wick by example? We can’t find a servant of God testified of in scripture submitting to the wicked. We didn’t see Daniel submitting to the wicked; therefore he was put in the lion’s den. We didn’t see Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego submit to the wicked either, therefore they were cast into the fire that was set to kill all that disobeyed King Nebuchadnezzar. It says in the book of Daniel 1: 5-20 5And the king appointed them a daily provision of the king's meat, and of the wine which he drank: so nourishing them three years, that at the end thereof they might stand before the king. 6Now among these were of the children of Judah, Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah: 7Unto whom the prince of the eunuchs gave names: for he gave unto Daniel the name of Belteshazzar; and to Hananiah, of Shadrach; and to Mishael, of Meshach; and to Azariah, of Abednego. 8But Daniel purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself with the portion of the king's meat, nor with the wine which he drank: therefore he requested of the prince of the eunuchs that he might not defile himself. 9Now God had brought Daniel into favour and tender love with the prince of the eunuchs. 10And the prince of the eunuchs said unto Daniel, I fear my lord the king, who hath appointed your meat and your drink: for why should he see your faces worse liking than the children which are of your sort? then shall ye make me endanger my head to the king. 11Then said Daniel to Melzar, whom the prince of the eunuchs had set over Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah, 12Prove thy servants, I beseech thee, ten days; and let them give us pulse to eat, and water to drink. 13Then let our countenances be looked upon before thee, and the countenance of the children that eat of the portion of the king's meat: and as thou seest, deal with thy servants. 14So he consented to them in this matter, and proved them ten days. 15And at the end of ten days their countenances appeared fairer and fatter in flesh than all the children which did eat the portion of the king's meat. 16Thus Melzar took away the portion of their meat, and the wine that they should drink; and gave them pulse. 17As for these four children, God gave them knowledge and skill in all learning and wisdom: and Daniel had understanding in all visions and dreams. 18Now at the end of the days that the king had said he should bring them in, then the prince of the eunuchs brought them in before Nebuchadnezzar. 19And the king communed with them; and among them all was found none like Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah: therefore stood they before the king. 20And in all matters of wisdom and understanding, that the king enquired of them, he found them ten times better than all the magicians and astrologers that were in all his realm. This is the kind of example we should pattern ourselves after. We should not conform to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of our minds to serve God, and serve him only. Do not be blinded by the lust of the flesh, what is pleasing to the fleshly eyes, or to the fleshly ears. Walk soberly; keeping your body under subjection to the spirit of God that lives in you at all times. We fail this mission when we give in to the nature of the flesh. Let conscious be you guide and not the nature or lust of the flesh.


16Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.

Those prophets, and men of God of old time continually warned the people of their ways. Books where made of the word of God that he reveal to his servants to continue to warn the people. We have plenty of books within the bible to bring to remembrance, as well as those books that are considered by some to be lost books. It still remains on the individual to seek out truth that is contained in these books to be remembered of the word of God.

17And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.

We belong to God when we hearken to his every word. Every word spoken by God is commandment, with the purpose of eternal life within it. Is not Christ Jesus the word of God with eternal life abiding in him to give to us? Yes it is. When we hearken to the word we become Gods jewels and precious stones, because we abide in him and he in us, by our submission to his will.

18Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.

Does Paul not also say this in I John 4: 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error. As we should see the word of God is consistent no matter the servant that God used to bring it. When we walk in the spirit, submitting or body to the spirit of God that is in us, we then can discern the righteous from the wicked, and the truth from the error. If we continue to walk in the nature of the flesh we can’t make this discernment, for we are ever entangled in the affairs of this fleshly world, and submitting in giving all authority to the nature of the flesh.

[walkinthespirit]

Oh Lord that YOU would rend the heavens and come down, and let us see YOUR ways, and give us increased discernment, understanding, revelation, knowledge, and wisdom for this day and the days ahead!

More of YOU and less of me LORD! empty me!

Thanks Israel, may the Lord shower HIS blessings upon you and yours! WO:

Excellent, Israel. We do not see for the most part our continued persistance in staying in our flesh and battling there is simply rebellion against His gift. You are right.... we are robbing God. He has bought us, He owns us, he can do with us as He wills, and yet, how often it is our will that still wins out.

We seldom hear cries of "What will you have me do Lord?", or "What shall I believe? Tell me Lord, and I will do it! I will believe!"

How long shall we walk on in disobedience, with our eyes shut to the goodness of God, trying to establish our own righteousness. How many times must we fall before we give up and accept the gift of a new heart from God's hand. We say it is weakness, or misunderstanding, but in truth, it is simply that we want to run our own lives, do what we want, go where we feel like going, instead of presenting our bodies a loving sacrifice, which God's word clearly proclaims is our reasonable service!

We are clearly told...We are not our own, we are bought with a price. The days of walking after our own desires, doing what seems right in our own eyes, is rapidly coming to a close. There is no safety there. There is no deliverer there. The heart is deceitful above all else and until we see the need to flee the flesh as a spotted rag, we walk in blindness and open ourselves to all manner of deception.

[Israel]

Awesome; There are not many "Isreal" that understand exactly where you are coming from. To them, you speak heresy. To them, you are a trader and not a believer. This is because they are so steeped in the doctrine of men and yet don't know it. To say, one does not have to pay tithes (money) and that they need only to offer themselves as tithes or their bodies as living sacrifices, is hard for many to accept because they have been and are being taught today that to not pay tithes is to fall short of their blessing. I also believed at one point that I would rain hell fire and damnation upon my soul if I did not pay tithes(money) to the church. I paid for years and went into bankruptcy trying to be obedient to a doctrine that was putting me in deeper bondage rather than setting me free. I experienced true freedom when I came to realize what was happening to me and began to accept the Word of God as the Word of God.

Originally Posted by Israel

Awesome; There are not many "Isreal" that understand exactly where you are coming from. To them, you speak heresy. To them, you are a trader and not a believer. This is because they are so steeped in the doctrine of men and yet don't know it. To say, one does not have to pay tithes (money) and that they need only to offer themselves as tithes or their bodies as living sacrifices, is hard for many to accept because they have been and are being taught today that to not pay tithes is to fall short of their blessing. I also believed at one point that I would rain hell fire and damnation upon my soul if I did not pay tithes(money) to the church. I paid for years and went into bankruptcy trying to be obedient to a doctrine that was putting me in deeper bondage rather than setting me free. I experienced true freedom when I came to realize what was happening to me and began to accept the Word of God as the Word of God.

Greetings Val,

I see you have managed to free yourself of part of that burdensome yoke of manmande organized religion. In another thread I had mentioned the 10% church tax which is a tradition of man that was of the time of John the Baptist. Jesus teaches us to give all we have to give. And "let not the left hand see what the right hand is doing". In other words to give in the 'true spirit' of giving we are to do it spontaneously and purely out of the goodness of our hearts, never asking for or expecting anything in return. There lies the dilemna with the 10% church tax. You know exactly how much you are giving (10%). You know exactly who the benefactor is (the church). You know exactly when you are giving it (next time you go to church). The left hand can clearly see what the right hand is doing; and you are asking for and expecting to go to heaven as a result. I would never say that giving in such a way is never 'counted unto righteousness' simply because people are forgiven when they know not what they do. But giving in such a manner is far from doing it in the 'true spirit' of giving. Plus that 'tradition of man' was resurrected solely to support a manmade counterfeit preisthood, so you are better off casting your pearls elsewhere, eh.

[Dewayne]

Great thread! wow how often have I not done what the spirit has told me to do.
in the flesh way to much. But God has been dealing with me lately to draw to Him.
this has opened my eyes to some things I was having problems with.
Paying tithes is one of them. I have been raised where we did pay tithes to the church.
but have not been able, or have not been doing it sence I have been disabled.
and I have been having a problem with it.
But the Lord will show me I,m sure of that.
I like what Bruce has said : What will you have me do Lord?" not many christans will have the nerve to say this. dont want to be put on the spot, just get saved and sit back and sit down. but I dont think we can do this at all.

as long as we are walking in our flesh, we are robbing God of His tithes and offerings,

Again Great thread my Friend!..........Dewayne

[Soulheart3]

Probably a great thread, just tagging it now to come back and read it entirely later. Thanks for your input Isreal!

[Amadeus]

Hello Israel! Good to see you here again!

Originally Posted by Israel

Malachi 3: 1-18

... John the Baptist. Who sent this messenger God did. Who did he prepare the way for? Christ. Is not Christ of God, his first begotten? Yes he is. To be off something means that you consist by the attributes of the very thing you are of. That means Jesus is God. So the spirit sent this messenger to testify and prepare the way for the spirit to work. God is spirit therefore all that is begotten of him is spirit also.

That means that we if we are of God are Spirit as well. We then have Life in us and the only real Life is God. Jesus said "I am the Life", but we can be Life as well if we are in Him and He is in us.

... the Levites (Priest) became self-righteous, and not patterned after Godly righteousness. They added and taken away from the commandments, laws, which are all the words of the living God. This is what they had to be purified from and purged from. They where purged and purified by being set down, and Christ baring the order and authority of the Priesthood within himself, because of there disobedience.

Anyone who believes that they can never be removed, purged, should look to the natural Levites!

Christ came out of Judah, which is the tribe of the Kings of Israel. Christ is know both King of Kings, and High priest after a different order then Levi. Because Christ came out of Judah and is now also High Priest, who also makes the offering to God out of presenting us as we submit to his will, this is how the offering of Judah and Jerusalem is pleasant unto the Lord. Levi is not longer High Priest; therefore he not longer can live of the tithes. Now that Christ is High Priest we offer up spiritual tithes, offerings, and sacrifices to our High Priest....

all things that are deemed to be in high regard by the flesh, the order of man, the government of man, the doctrine of man, the religion of man, and the false church which is made by mans hands. The true Church and undefiled is who we are within as we submit to Gods will. Those that submit to Gods will, is the Church. This is the Church made without hands. So for those that say well the church needs my tithe money to operate. What Church are they talking about? Surely they can’t be talking about the Church made within us through Christ. God doesn’t need any product of the fleshly nature to function....

Amen my brother!

.... Christ is against the adulterers both in the flesh and in the spirit. One commits physical adultery when one sleeps with someone outside of a marriage. There is not difference in spiritual adultery. God is the husband, and the church is the wife. If the wife (Church) goes astray and follows other doctrines, it is then committing spiritual adultery against God. Christ is against a liar of the mouth, just as he is against one who advocates false doctrine.

Are we of His bride or?

Christ is also against those that oppress (tax) the hireling (worker) of his wages (earnings) both in the physical and in the spiritual. One is oppressed in the physical of his earnings when he is forced to pay tribute (tax) and usury (interest) to the false authority of man. In the spiritual we are robbed and oppressed when we are forced (brought under privilege) or penalized (under due process of mans law) for not submitting to the order of man through mans government, which is a tribute (tax) and usury (interest) against the spirit.

This speaks not only of the Levitical priesthood, but of the governments established by man to accomplish man's works. Help us O Lord!

... Man has no authority over another man by God, but he assumes a possession of authority above all that is called by and for God. Man was not the start of any of Gods creation, so where is his authority given? The bible says surrender our self, and subject our selves to the higher power, which is God, and God only. Who is putting themselves over all things that God has made? Man puts himself over all that God has made and created through the power of Satan.

Glory to His name!

... God has not changed... Because God shows mercy and is consistent in showing so, there is hope... Because man has consistently walked contrary to God, those that remain this way will be destroyed by there own nature from within.

With all of this there is still hope!

God continues to call out to those that are lost, to bring them back to the Godly purpose of their creation, but man in his fleshly nature is to blind to see God.... The purpose of returning to God is eternal life. Man being fleshly minded can only see the glory of the fleshly, therefore those that are guided by the fleshly will be void of the spiritual. If we put off the nature of the flesh by submitting to God, which is returning to him, he will then also return and live in us.

All God wants is that we please Him!

What has man robbed God in? Is it money? Is it anything of carnality (fleshly)? No. Man has robbed God, by not submitting his spirit, which he received of God, back to God in obedience. We are the tithe and the offering....

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service." Rom 12:1

Where is Levi today? Are we under the order of the priesthood given to Levi, or are we under Christ, who priesthood is not carnal but spiritual? Most will reply that they are under Christ so then why do we walk in the order of Levi baring Christ in it? We walk in the order of Levi when we pay a carnal (money) tithe, thinking it is required of a spiritual order also. Under Christ we are to present our bodies as a living sacrifice, which is the tithe, offering, and sacrifice which will lead all that submit to eternal life. Christ doesn’t need mans money, nor does he want it.

"He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers?

Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free." Matt 17:25-26

The nation of Israel robbed God because they refused to submit to him, just as the world today continues to perpetuate this same deed....
When the servant of God calls out to these dry bones (fleshly nature), it is calling out to ones spirit to be submissive to the God. When we are submissive to God, his nature is our nature. When we do this we return back to the purpose that he created man for, which is in Gods image and likeness. Stop robbing God. Give back to God by giving your spirit in subjection to God. Remember we can’t submit to God totally, when we also submit ourselves subject to the flesh.

Let us all stop robbing God of that which is His... you and me!

How many have give carnal tithes consistently, and consistently not been blessed? How many give to the so call churches, and not receive any thing in return? How many give to the so-called churches, but when it comes to your needs the doors are closed. How many see that the only one who is blessed in the so-called churches is its pastor or its leader by whatever title he calls him or herself? ....

One must first understand that the church of God is in you. Christ spoke about the church made without hands being what he has built. Why then do we continually seek a building as the church? Wake up my people. Wake up. Walk as the body of Christ, the church, the tabernacle, the holy city, the New Jerusalem, which are all the Lords habitation. Walk with the understanding that God lives in you.....

We are the God's Church. If we are not the Church then someone else is! If God called us to be a part, then is the choice not ours?

The devourer of our sake is the one that is against us, and our purpose as we are of the purpose of God. When our purpose (sake) is inline with God’s purpose (sake) he will safe guard us. God’s sake is his every word, which is commandment. When we live after the purpose of God, which is his every word, we have transformed by the renewing of our mind to walk after the spirit, and not the flesh.

Help us Lord to be renewed and then to stay renewed!

When are purpose is inline with Gods purpose, we are the delightsome land. The land that we are is the church, the tabernacle, the New Jerusalem, the Holy City, which is all the Lords habitation. How many understand that we are the land of the Lord as abide in him and he in us? In order to walk as spiritual being we must understand that are the land

Now we only stewards, but if we endure with Him then we will inherit. Then it will ours.

"Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth." Matt 5:5

"Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:" Matt 25:34

The words of the fleshly man represented by Israel has always been contrary or against God, because the fleshly can only see with the physical eye. But those that submit to God see all things in spirit. Because the fleshly man can’t see spiritually his ways are against the ways of God.

Glory to His name!

We often hear lots of individuals say “ Its fine to serve God”, but in the real world we have to do this or do that. In the real world we have to pay taxes. In the real world we must fall subject to mans law. In the real world we need money to live. In the real world we need to vote in regarding the election of officials to run the nation, state, county, and cities. See how man regards the fleshly nature of man more than God. When we regard God above all things, we need not regard any order of man that is contrary to God sake, and purpose. We need to stop letting the fleshly nature tell us what we need. When we let the nature of the flesh do this, we are guided and in bondage to the flesh.

The spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me... he hath sent me... to proclaim liberty to the captives,... Isa 61:1

As we walk after the flesh, wanting, and lusting after all the things of a fleshly nature, we see those that have obtain much in the flesh to be blessed and happy. These individuals are caught up in the bride of a fleshly life. Those that have much in this life often times obtain through wicked works. Those that are set up in government, banks, corporation, and false churches are the workers of iniquity.... We must all understand that we put our hands with the wicked when we submit to the order of the wicked. When do we see the servants of God submit to the order of the wick by example? We can’t find a servant of God testified of in scripture submitting to the wicked. We didn’t see Daniel submitting to the wicked; therefore he was put in the lion’s den. We didn’t see Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego submit to the wicked either, therefore they were cast into the fire that was set to kill all that disobeyed King Nebuchadnezzar....

This is the kind of example we should pattern ourselves after. We should not conform to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of our minds to serve God, and serve him only. Do not be blinded by the lust of the flesh, what is pleasing to the fleshly eyes, or to the fleshly ears. Walk soberly; keeping your body under subjection to the spirit of God that lives in you at all times. We fail this mission when we give in to the nature of the flesh. Let conscious be you guide and not the nature or lust of the flesh.

We cannot do it, but God that in us can!

We belong to God when we hearken to his every word. Every word spoken by God is commandment, with the purpose of eternal life within it. Is not Christ Jesus the word of God with eternal life abiding in him to give to us? Yes it is. When we hearken to the word we become Gods jewels and precious stones, because we abide in him and he in us, by our submission to his will.[/quote]

"Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you." James 4:7

Does Paul not also say this in I John 4: 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error. As we should see the word of God is consistent no matter the servant that God used to bring it. When we walk in the spirit, submitting or body to the spirit of God that is in us, we then can discern the righteous from the wicked, and the truth from the error. If we continue to walk in the nature of the flesh we can’t make this discernment, for we are ever entangled in the affairs of this fleshly world, and submitting in giving all authority to the nature of the flesh.

Thank you for these words from the Lord, Israel!

John,

[doinghiswill]

Originally Posted by Israel

Awesome; There are not many "Isreal" that understand exactly where you are coming from. To them, you speak heresy. To them, you are a trader and not a believer. This is because they are so steeped in the doctrine of men and yet don't know it. To say, one does not have to pay tithes (money) and that they need only to offer themselves as tithes or their bodies as living sacrifices, is hard for many to accept because they have been and are being taught today that to not pay tithes is to fall short of their blessing. I also believed at one point that I would rain hell fire and damnation upon my soul if I did not pay tithes(money) to the church. I paid for years and went into bankruptcy trying to be obedient to a doctrine that was putting me in deeper bondage rather than setting me free. I experienced true freedom when I came to realize what was happening to me and began to accept the Word of God as the Word of God.

So true, just today in bible study we were talking about the word of God being the word of God, and following and believe it as such. That is clinging to it and trusting the author of it(the Bible)as being true for me. Even when it seems to be impossiable t to live in it I remember:

2Co 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

I'm finding in every area of my life this hold true. So like you said since I am not my own.......

[Soulheart3]

Finally got my myself to check the thread out fully. Amen Isreal, we are the main thing the Lord wants in our offerings. Although I dont tithe either, I save up money and if a need arises, and the spirit moves, I give freely to those in need, and I know the money or items are getting to the needed person. I also help out sometimes even if not lead to, but in those cases, I dont give money, I give things so that the money is not used for booze, or drugs or something, for I am a steward of many things, money just being one of them, and I consider it important that my giving is not used for ill.

-Brad